i can see why this tour is a good idea.
i am not sure if you are really showing the most important parts.
for example I would talk about adding a language and creating sample data.

finaly the tone/voice of the language used is, for me, not appropriate. When you use a metaphor or a simile then it makes it much harder to be understood by someone who is not a native speaker.

perhaps @ceford can help you with the text

Please avoid using the word "click" and instead use the word "select". You can't click with a keyboard or with your finger.

Please avoid using metaphores and similes - they are difficult, and sometimes impossible, to understand if english is not your native language

I have tested this item ✅ successfully on c6c30a9

Worked like a dream. Well done all

I have tested this item 🔴 unsuccessfully on de42648

I have tested this item 🔴 unsuccessfully on de42648

Hi Brian @brianteeman, did you fail the PR because of technicality or because of the wording?
The tour is short on purpose and not touching all areas of the dashboard (we would like to create a more elaborate tour for that). The tone is meant to give it some energy and enthusiasm.
If you think some sentences are still not quite right, what would you say instead?
Thank for your feedback.

its failing because the english is bad and not following our style guides and despite asking multiple times you are still using simile and metaphor. I am offline for the next 48 hours

its failing because the english is bad and not following our style guides and despite asking multiple times you are still using simile and metaphor. I am offline for the next 48 hours

That's not a fail of the functionality. This is a Welcome page in a Guided tour, a way of inviting people who are new to Joomla and it needs to be friendly and inviting. We don't have a style guide for such new tools.
Its not a manual or documentation page, we have never had this sort information area before.

The constructive way would have been to offer text alternatives if you really think its that bad.
To just hit fail with no explanation is "not following our style guides" and not the way a friendly and constructive community works.

There has been a lot of work involved in this from many years of GSoC students and we need to honour that work with the respect it deserves. Students will look at such projects in the future and need to know that if someone suggests something and that suggestion is not adhered to to the letter, the offending Metaphor was removed, then they will not be penalised with a failure when the PR did what it was intended to do.

Further discussion was an alternative, we are a collaborative project and failing a PR when it did not fail the writers criteria and leaving no explanation is not the Joomla way

@brianteeman I think that having a little of humor is good, that make the thing more live and positive.
And because it is translatable, the translators will adopt it to their languages.

You know I am not native english speaker, but the text still sounds good to me.

I am sort of with Brian on this one. Technically the tour works but what it says is far from satisfactory. First some general points:

The Tour does not say it is a Tour. It is just there in the middle of the screen. What are newcomers to think? Perhaps a button in the bottom bar that says 'Skip Tour' or 'Close Tour' might help. Or revised text as below...

The two items: 'How to create a guided tour' and 'How to add steps to a guided tour' should not be in the default menu, let alone at the top. They are the last things that a newcomer will want to see. Also changing the menu order depending on context caused me to blink - a bad user experience.

Now to the content:

The first page: managing a cms is not 'fun' - it is 'work'. It could have said something like 'This is the first of a set of Guided Tours that help newcomers to understand Joomla administration. ...

For me, pages 2 and 3 are in the wrong order! I would move page 2 to page 4 because the menu is mostly closed and probably the most difficult to describe.

The 'Quick access sections' is pointing to the menu but what it describes is the Home Dashboard - so that is just plain wrong.

The last page needs a lot of thought! The two last places I would send a Joomla newcomer to are Mattermost and GitHub. (I have taken a personal dislike to Mattermost because it is impossible to keep up with the largely unthreaded conversations.) It repeats a long-standing Joomla documentation problem - too many links to too many places. Just refer to the Help link in the menu!

I suppose I could write my own language overrides to suit myself.

The Tour does not say it is a Tour. It is just there in the middle of the screen. What are newcomers to think?

Maybe it would be better to show a littlle popover, similar to what others doing:

Instead of autostart make a showTourOffer column. With this we can have multiple offers, wich show up in order one after another.

Addittionaly it probably need to be per-user? can be a JSON column "participatedUsers", wich store

{
  "<user id>": {"state": "finished"},
  "<user id2>": {"state": "rejected"},
}

But that a loot of work :)

The Tour does not say it is a Tour. It is just there in the middle of the screen. What are newcomers to think? Perhaps a button in the bottom bar that says 'Skip Tour' or 'Close Tour' might help. Or revised text as below...

Why do you need to say it's a tour? I don't really understand the need.
The tour can be cancelled (x).
There is much more functionality that is planned for future releases, and 'skip' is one option that would be valuable in this case, indeed, agreed.

The two items: 'How to create a guided tour' and 'How to add steps to a guided tour' should not be in the default menu, let alone at the top. They are the last things that a newcomer will want to see. Also changing the menu order depending on context caused me to blink - a bad user experience.

There is no change in the tour's order. There is now an extra list of tours that is showing tours in context with the page a user is in. Nothing to do with this PR, though.

The 'guided tours' show first because that is the way they have been initially included in the database.
This is something that should be changed on new installs, I agree, anyone is welcome to create a PR to change that order.

Now to the content:

The first page: managing a cms is not 'fun' - it is 'work'. It could have said something like 'This is the first of a set of Guided Tours that help newcomers to understand Joomla administration. ...

This is a welcome tour, supposed to give initial guidance into the interface and the community.
One of the steps mentions the availability of more tours ('if you get lost, either check out the available tours or come back to the dashboard'). Agree we could make a stronger point that there are more tours to learn your way around.

For me, pages 2 and 3 are in the wrong order! I would move page 2 to page 4 because the menu is mostly closed and probably the most difficult to describe.

Steps can be re-arranged, valid point.

The 'Quick access sections' is pointing to the menu but what it describes is the Home Dashboard - so that is just plain wrong.

It describes the dashboards available for each extension. But if it is confusing to you, it will probably be confusing to newbies as well. Maybe we should just skip that step...

The last page needs a lot of thought! The two last places I would send a Joomla newcomer to are Mattermost and GitHub. (I have taken a personal dislike to Mattermost because it is impossible to keep up with the largely unthreaded conversations.) It repeats a long-standing Joomla documentation problem - too many links to too many places. Just refer to the Help link in the menu!

That's personal opinion, but we still should be able to list all places people can get information from, and let them decide if they want to participate or not, but they have to be aware these possible avenues exist. Maybe also add a link to the joomla.org documentation website?

I suppose I could write my own language overrides to suit myself.

Yes!

Thank you for the feedback Cliff @ceford!

Maybe it would be better to show a littlle popover, similar to what others doing:

Definitely something we would see in a future improvement of guided tours.
There are many improvement ideas for auto-starting tours and let the users decide what they want to do.
This could just not be fully implemented at this time.

I can see you have ideas Fedir, you (or anyone else) is welcome to join the guided tours channel on Mattermost and share your ideas, opinions and help improve the tours.

Instead of autostart make a showTourOffer column. With this we can have multiple offers, wich show up in order one after another.

That can be an improvement for later, yes.

Addittionaly it probably need to be per-user? can be a JSON column "participatedUsers", wich store

{
  "<user id>": {"state": "finished"},
  "<user id2>": {"state": "rejected"},
}

Agreed we need to record user's decisions, if they left a tour and decide to see it later... many possibilities.
We are leaning toward a user/tour table, but it is still in discussion.

Thank you for the feedback Fedir @Fedik!

Further comment on the last page and those links to other sites:

Having captured the user attention, the last thing you want to do is provide an opportunity to immediately exit to other sites, something I have been telling my friends for 20 years. The Mattermost link takes you to a login page that (for me) invites me to Log in with one of the following: and I am offered Joomla Identity Portal which takes me to a the Joomla Identity Portal login page (where I need to register). This is not the right place to create this level of confusion! And GitHub - is a newcomer supposed to think it is normal to become familiar with that site and to get involved in Developer oriented matters?

For me, it would be best if the last page were deleted.

Having captured the user attention, the last thing you want to do is provide an opportunity to immediately exit to other sites, something I have been telling my friends for 20 years.

I totally agree with that comment, but I don't believe it applies here.
Users are not installing Joomla to leave it as soon as they have the opportunity to.

The Mattermost link takes you to a login page that (for me) invites me to Log in with one of the following: and I am offered Joomla Identity Portal which takes me to a the Joomla Identity Portal login page (where I need to register). This is not the right place to create this level of confusion! And GitHub - is a newcomer supposed to think it is normal to become familiar with that site and to get involved in Developer oriented matters?

For me, it would be best if the last page were deleted.

That last step is important, but like previously stated, should probably also link to the online documentation.
The forum link is important as well.
Getting into Mattermost is 'involved', indeed, but important to mention.
As far as GitHub is concerned, agree that a newbie does not need to get into that on first 'meet' with Joomla (but still, isn't it good to know a place exists?).

It is great to hear everyone's feedback, really appreciated.

However, we are not getting any feedback from the users who are the real target of this PR.
We can keep going back and forth about what we all think is best, keep tweaking the wording, the links... but we are still people who are using Joomla on a daily basis...

we are not getting any feedback from the users who are the real target of this PR

Which is maybe why the content is Developer oriented (and the Developers can't see it). That last page is a bit like tha airline cabin crew pointing out the emergency exits - experienced fliers will ignore it while newcomers squirm in their seats.

I have updated the last step so it reflects all concerns and discussions we were having about linking to outside sites.
There is one remaining link that now leads to the console help page.

@ceford I think that's a better compromise now, also a part of this is to extend the help page with more community information proposed in #21990

I'm not so happy about the wording of the tour, it's too "unprofessional" more written for a game and not a professional software.

A guided tour is beneficial for those who are new to Joomla or to the functionality of the latest version of Joomla.
It's meant to be engaging and friendly, encouraging and handholding for that group who are nervous. We can keep making it more and more formal, but then we will be talking to the exact group who already know how to use the product, those who will hit the X and delete the tour, rather than the nervous ones who will be reassured by a warm and engaging message.
We have already made it a lot less engaging and friendly, taking into consideration previous comments.
Can there be some compromise on this?

you generate expectations which the product doesn't fulfill, if you want to go the way to make joomla more funny then this has to be done in the full, so now it's only a half thing. Having a concept for the language style to use would be useful in this case.

From my point consistent is more important then having some (maybe) funny statements somewhere. Also it really depends on your target groups. And since I think we are moving more and more into professional agency market it's more important to have a proper professional entrance.

I have just started writing some language overrides to see how it comes out the way I would do it. here is the first one:

COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_DESCRIPTION

<p>This is the first of a set of Guided Tours designed to introduce newcomers to the main features of the Joomla Administrator pages, sometimes referred to collectively as the <strong>backend</strong> to distinguish it from the <strong>frontend</strong> public Site pages. The Administrator pages are used to configure and manage your whole Joomla website. </p>

<p>The current page is the <strong>Home Dashboard</strong>, the starting point for access to the Administrator menu, to the left, and the Quick access panels, to the right.</p>

<p>Please select <strong>Start</strong> to continue this brief tour or the </strong>X</strong> symbol above to close the tour. You can take the tour again at any time.</p>

You could try it out - see what you think.

An aside, I personally never use the term backend. In English it is a derogatory term applied to horses, cows, women and decaying industrial towns.

Deciding with main target group is important here.

Personaly I do not like "very formal text", in most cases it is "dry" and bored stuff, writen just to say "hey we have a text!".

For now, I want to suggest a compromise text for the intro:

Old

<p>
  <em>Congratulations</em>, the most important step is done: you have installed Joomla! 
  Now comes the fun part.
</p>
<p>
  This is called “The Backend” of your Joomla installation, otherwise known as the “Administrator” area.
  <br>Here you have the power to configure and manage your whole Joomla website.
</p>
<p>Now you can start your journey to become a Joomla Administrator!</p>

New

<p>
  <em>Congratulations</em>, the most important step is done: you have installed Joomla! 
  Now comes the interesting part.
</p>
<p>
  You are in so called “The Backend” of your Joomla installation, otherwise known as the “Administrator” area.
  <br>Here you can configure and manage your whole Joomla website.
</p>
<p>Now you can start your journey to become a Joomla Administrator!</p>
<p>Push Start button to continue the tour, or close to stop the tour</p>

UPD: @ceford was faster, while I writing my comment :) Ignore my text.

Further to me previous comment, you could paste this into administrator/language/overrides/en-GB.override.ini:

COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_DESCRIPTION="<p>This is the first of a set of Guided Tours designed to introduce newcomers to the main features of the Joomla Administrator pages, sometimes referred to collectively as the <strong>backend</strong> to distinguish it from the <strong>frontend</strong> public Site pages. The Administrator pages are used to configure and manage your whole Joomla website. \n</p>\n<p>The current page is the <strong>Home Dashboard</strong>, the starting point for access to the Administrator menu, to the left, and the Quick access panels, to the right.</p>\n<p>\nPlease select <strong>Start</strong> to continue this brief tour or the </strong>X</strong> symbol above to close the tour. You can take the tour again at any time.</p>\n"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_FINALWORDS_DESCRIPTION="<p>Many resources are available where you can find help, learn more and become more involved in Joomla Itself if you wish. See the list available via the <a href=\"index.php?option=com_cpanel&view=cpanel&dashboard=help\">Help</a> menu.</p>"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_FINALWORDS_TITLE="Help and Information"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_MENUS_DESCRIPTION="<p>The menu provides access to the Administrator management pages. Each section has a collection of pages for managing that particular aspect of Joomla, such as Content, Menus and Users.</p>\n<p>The window pane icons link to individual dashboards for those menu groups. The System menu itself leads to a dashboard. </p>\n<p>The Help menu item leads to another dashboard containing links to many sources of Joomla help and information.</p> "
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_NOTIFICATIONS_DESCRIPTION="<p>The Notifications panel shows whether updates are available for Joomla! and other extensions that provide update sites. Any outstanding Privacy Requests are shown here too.</p>"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_NOTIFICATIONS_TITLE="The Notifications panel"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_QUICKACCESS_DESCRIPTION="<p>Dashboards provide quick access to frequently used pages via their icons.</p>\n<p>Each dashboard panel is an Administrator module that can be added to or removed from a dashboard and \neach panel may have items added or removed via its Settings icon (<span class=\"icon-cogs\" aria-hidden=\"true\"></span>). This allows you to configure your site dashboards to suit your own purposes.</p>"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_QUICKACCESS_TITLE="The dashboard panels"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_TOPBAR_DESCRIPTION="<p>The title bar shows the title of the displayed page. The other items in the title bar are modules that you can configure to display or not as you see fit.</p>\n<p>Your current Joomla version and the list of tours are often the next items in the title bar.</p>\n<p>The last items in the title bar are usually a link to the Site frontend and the User Menu where you can change your password, personal settings and logout.</p>"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_TOPBAR_TITLE="The Title bar"

Remove when finished with or rename the file so it won't be loaded.

Page 3 needs the wee pointer moved to the right hand side.

Bug: after selecting any link, the back button disappears.

Never would I have guessed that when the Welcome Tour was envisioned that it would cause such discussion.

The goal of the tour is to invite those who are new to Joomla to enter, explore and use it to create incredible website. The messaging is intended to engage with them in a welcoming and comforting manner, keeping in mind that the person may not be a developer.

The discussions seem to have moved off of the inclusion, which seems to be reluctantly accepted, and onto the wording, largely the tone and voice. Summarizing what I think I am seeing and reading is that the main concern is how do we reach our goal of a warm welcome message that is engaging, while also presenting it professionally.

Unfortunately, representatives of the intended audience are not present in these discussions. Because of this, key feedback is missing.

While Olivier and I had hoped that by including this PR in the beta more feedback could be gained, it doesn’t appear that this will happen.

So, where do we go from here?

Perhaps the answer is to pull things back, socialize it out in a focus group manner, to get feedback from others. How to do this would need to be worked out but maybe then we can get to a general consensus on the sticking points, namely tone, voice, and wording.

While this pull back would be a disappointment, it may be what is needed to produce a feature that hits most of the points, creating a warm welcome for newbies, that presents Joomla in its best light.

Thoughts?

Unfortunately, representatives of the intended audience are not present in these discussions. Because of this, key feedback is missing.

that's normal (as we are on git) and it's true

personally speaking I even don't like this "tour" enabled by default
it should be an installing informed choice

anyway

So, where do we go from here?

we need to take a break and re-think, at :

what's the goal and how to achieve this

maybe a RFC pull reuquest ?

when we have more clear scope and proposed solution

The Welcome tour is useful. It gives us the chance to point out the main areas of the Home Dashboard: the Menu, the Title bar and the Dashboard Panels. Taking a break or pulling back is kicking the can down the road. I would prefer the feature to be included for the next beta release. We could then use the Language Override procedure to ask (Mattermost) users to see which wording they prefer (because installing and testing a beta is a lot simpler than testing a PR). Naturally, I would prefer more professional wording by default. But...

Further to me previous comment, you could paste this into administrator/language/overrides/en-GB.override.ini:

COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_DESCRIPTION="<p>This is the first of a set of Guided Tours designed to introduce newcomers to the main features of the Joomla Administrator pages, sometimes referred to collectively as the <strong>backend</strong> to distinguish it from the <strong>frontend</strong> public Site pages. The Administrator pages are used to configure and manage your whole Joomla website. \n</p>\n<p>The current page is the <strong>Home Dashboard</strong>, the starting point for access to the Administrator menu, to the left, and the Quick access panels, to the right.</p>\n<p>\nPlease select <strong>Start</strong> to continue this brief tour or the </strong>X</strong> symbol above to close the tour. You can take the tour again at any time.</p>\n"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_FINALWORDS_DESCRIPTION="<p>Many resources are available where you can find help, learn more and become more involved in Joomla Itself if you wish. See the list available via the <a href=\"index.php?option=com_cpanel&view=cpanel&dashboard=help\">Help</a> menu.</p>"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_FINALWORDS_TITLE="Help and Information"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_MENUS_DESCRIPTION="<p>The menu provides access to the Administrator management pages. Each section has a collection of pages for managing that particular aspect of Joomla, such as Content, Menus and Users.</p>\n<p>The window pane icons link to individual dashboards for those menu groups. The System menu itself leads to a dashboard. </p>\n<p>The Help menu item leads to another dashboard containing links to many sources of Joomla help and information.</p> "
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_NOTIFICATIONS_DESCRIPTION="<p>The Notifications panel shows whether updates are available for Joomla! and other extensions that provide update sites. Any outstanding Privacy Requests are shown here too.</p>"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_NOTIFICATIONS_TITLE="The Notifications panel"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_QUICKACCESS_DESCRIPTION="<p>Dashboards provide quick access to frequently used pages via their icons.</p>\n<p>Each dashboard panel is an Administrator module that can be added to or removed from a dashboard and \neach panel may have items added or removed via its Settings icon (<span class=\"icon-cogs\" aria-hidden=\"true\"></span>). This allows you to configure your site dashboards to suit your own purposes.</p>"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_QUICKACCESS_TITLE="The dashboard panels"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_TOPBAR_DESCRIPTION="<p>The title bar shows the title of the displayed page. The other items in the title bar are modules that you can configure to display or not as you see fit.</p>\n<p>Your current Joomla version and the list of tours are often the next items in the title bar.</p>\n<p>The last items in the title bar are usually a link to the Site frontend and the User Menu where you can change your password, personal settings and logout.</p>"
COM_GUIDEDTOURS_TOUR_WELCOMETOJOOMLA_STEP_TOPBAR_TITLE="The Title bar"

Remove when finished with or rename the file so it won't be loaded.

Page 3 needs the wee pointer moved to the right hand side.

Bug: after selecting any link, the back button disappears.

I would like to see this version for now and discuss the CMS language at a later point?

I have updated the content with most of Cliff's wording for now.

I have read through Cliff's and Olivier's wording and it all seems good to me.
I really hope it helps the new administrators who take on Joomla projects and have a steep learning curve

@Quy you are probably found out this issue under Firefox.

There is no way, that I know of, to target the notification panel. Therefore, .has is being used as selector as the appropriate solution.

It provides a good experience for a majority of users, and a slightly degraded experience for users of Firefox without breaking the tour.

The console log is generated by the third party library used to create tours. We cannot remove it.

I opted for a good user experience for most users, rather than a degraded experience for all.

Firefox .has support will hopefully come soon, it's been years in the testing phase...

System tests fails, I can't merge it if they fail....

https://ci.joomla.org/artifacts/joomla/joomla-cms/5.0-dev/41659/system-tests/70485/screenshots/install/Installation.cy.js/Install%20Joomla%20--%20Install%20Joomla%20(failed).png

Also breaking firefox is not an option, we need to find a solution for this.

@laoneo can you help here I don't see a reason why the api tests fails and why the registration tests (it seems mail is deactivated) in frontend fail because they work on 5.0-dev branch

https://ci.joomla.org/artifacts/joomla/joomla-cms/5.0-dev/41659/system-tests/70485/screenshots/site/components/

Also breaking firefox is not an option, we need to find a solution for this.

Maybe adding the module as class which is rendered to the card would make sense anyway? Sadly we not have an alias per module also we don't have a fix id... so maybe it's impossible to select a module? hmm...

not sure if a polyfill like https://github.com/jplhomer/polyfill-css-has would work

There is no way, that I know of, to target the notification panel. Therefore, .has is being used as selector as the appropriate solution.

What is purpose of this selector, highlight whole "notification" module or?

I can suggest 2 alternative:

• add class

  joomla-cms/administrator/modules/mod_quickicon/tmpl/default.php

  Line 25 in 1e7c08e

  <nav class="quick-icons px-3 pb-3" aria-label="<?php echo Text::_('MOD_QUICKICON_NAV_LABEL') . ' ' . $module->title; ?>">

  Like

<nav class="quick-icons px-3 pb-3 <?php echo 'quick-icons-' . $params->get('context', '') ?>" ....>

Then target .quick-icons-update_quickicon

• add class in to moduleclass_sfx params of the module, and use it as target, but this probably will work only for new installations, and will not for update.

offtopic: It would be nice if I can add

$params->set('moduleclass_sfx', 'quick-icons-' . $params->get('context', ''));

In module layout, but it does not work currently

I have made a PR to resolve :has,

• #41857

After this PR will be merged we can use .quickicons-for-update_quickicon selector for quickicons module-wrapper

Thanks Fedir @Fedik for the PR #41857. It allowed the removal of the .has selector for the notifications step. The tours are now identical for all users thanks to the fix you provided.

so only ci is need

In the last step, preferably highlight the Help menu and remove the link in the body so it is obvious where the link is.

In the last step, preferably highlight the Help menu and remove the link in the body so it is obvious where the link is.

Phil @softforge what do you think?

so only ci is need

I suspect we need a test that closes the tour after install so the test tasks can continue, right? I don't understand how to create such a command, if that is what it needs to be done Allon @laoneo.

Thanks

@ceford @HLeithner for keeping the language understandable and consistent with the professional approach to the rest of the joomla ui

Autostart

This is a really nice idea but unfortunately the implementation makes it less useful than might appear. My understanding of this PR is that the tour is to be used for onboarding new users. The “problem” is that the tour autostart functionality is per site and not per user and there is no way to re-enable it.

For example if I install joomla and do the basic config for a client then I would want the client to see the tour when they log in for the first time but other than directly editing the database there is no way I can do this.

If the autostart flag is stored with the tour and not the user this would not be a problem.

Instead of setting the flag in the tour database you could set it in the user record and instead of setting a flag to say DO SHOW the tour if you have it so that the tour is displayed by default and it is only NOT SHOWN if the user has a flag set to say they have seen (or dismissed) the tour.

ACL

The tour will run for any user - however some of the steps are for places that the user might not have access to see. For example the step about the notification area of the dashboard. These notifications are not displayed to a default manager. The same is true for the menu item for menus which is also not shown.

Autostart

This is a really nice idea but unfortunately the implementation makes it less useful than might appear. My understanding of this PR is that the tour is to be used for onboarding new users. The “problem” is that the tour autostart functionality is per site and not per user and there is no way to re-enable it.

ACL

The tour will run for any user - however some of the steps are for places that the user might not have access to see. For example the step about the notification area of the dashboard. These notifications are not displayed to a default manager. The same is true for the menu item for menus which is also not shown.

This is the first pr of this feature and we also discussed the "per" user approach. But it has challenges as you also describe acl have to be handled correctly. So this is nothing for 5.0 and might be possible with 5.1

For now it's more important that the system tests are working, or I can't merge it.

In the last step, preferably highlight the Help menu and remove the link in the body so it is obvious where the link is.

Phil @softforge what do you think?

It's a good point by @Quy for consistency, some will probably want to hit links and if not there will not try the Help menu but if a more uniform look is wanted then I can see it as being a positive change

After clicking the Help link in the body, I expected a different step but got the same one which confused me for a second.

Actually I can't have a look on it as I got sick.

Let’s highlight the Help menu and keep the link in the body and possibly add a final step.

Actually I can't have a look on it as I got sick.

Get well soon Allon @laoneo.

This is the first pr of this feature and we also discussed the "per" user approach. But it has challenges as you also describe acl have to be handled correctly. So this is nothing for 5.0 and might be possible with 5.1

Better to get the approach to autostart correctly than rush it through now and get stuck in b/c hell where you cant change it for another two years.

Without a working autostart then its pretty useless as it is and dont serve the intended purpose of onboarding new users.

For now it's more important that the system tests are working, or I can't merge it.

While the system tests are important of course as a starting point just because it passes the tests that have been created doesnt mean that it works - just that it passes some arbitrary tests

I should add that this restricts the functionality of "autostart" to just guided tours. It would be so much better if it was independent of any component

This pull request has been automatically rebased to 5.1-dev.

I have tested this item ✅ successfully on 46804ac

I tested it and didn't notice any problems.

Thank you so much for the work on this very useful feature 🎉 ❤️ @obuisard and everyone who supported this through reviewing, texting and testing.

Thank you Martina! This is a great team effort. Thank you to Phil @softforge and Shirielle @sdwjoomla who provided us with a new tour! Great thanks to Benjamin @bembelimen for the support and help throughout ('til the end!), to Harald @HLeithner for the help in our first attempt to get the PR merged to the core, and thank you to the reviewers and spotters for the wording and the code (among all Brian @brianteeman, Cliff @ceford, Fedir @Fedik). This kind of PR needs feedback and it is great to see people pitching in. Finally, thanks to the testers!