This is something for the a11y so calling @zwiastunsw and the english language team so calling also @brianteeman. I guess these two teams need to cooperate for the final strings, but I don't think a string like Username is accessible or descriptive enough for screen readers (or at least this is what's in my mind from the London sprint, might be wrong thou)

Account username could work too. I just don't see the need for a whole line to define what an input field is for

A setence needs a verb, I guess

For people relatively new to cms’ we should make it clear this is a master account. I don’t care if that’s a fieldset description or in the field labels

As far as I know there is no en-gb team anymore -at least for the last 362 days

A quick look at the strings and I agree with @wilsonge these changes create confusion not simplify thimgs

Speaking as a power user, before I was able to fly through the installation as I could quickly identify a key word in the shorter phrases, so I knew what to input and where to input it. Call me impatient, but now it's like having to carefully follow a recipe.

Furthermore, why are we using different words to start a sentence (Enter, Set, Specify, Either)?

@C-Lodder how about placeholders like Username etc. Then a power user will not even have to look at the left part (label)?

@dgt41 Nah cause it's adding even more clutter to which should be more simplistic. Personally I've always been a fan of form helpers, as in smaller text below the input as a brief description if needed.

Example of that is the "Select database type" in the screenshot above, (although not required for that field)

Username - Either one you created or supplied by your host
Password - Either one you created or supplied by your host
Database Name - Either one you created or supplied by your host
Table Prefix - The generated one below or create your own

??

Note it is NOT Database Table Name

Username - Either one you created or supplied by your host

are these the labels you suggest or a combo label placeholder?

Either as a label as is
Or with the bold as a label and the rest as a description

placeholders are evil!!!

For Login Data: Can we put the information in the headline like
"Create Joomla Super Administrator Account" or similar ?
Then the labels Username, Password and Your E-Mail address would be enough.

For Database: It can be also one i did neither created nor is supplied by my host, when i create a database local i can create it with the installer itself. So what about:
Headline: "Specify the Database to connect Joomla to" ?

And just at table prefix the further information "generated or specify your own"

My proposal:

1. Instead Login data: Create Super User account. Then labels are enough: Username, Email address, Password.
2. Instead Database Configuration: Configure Database. And then as suggested by @brianteeman:

• Database type - Select from the list below
• Hostname - Either "localhost" or a name provided by your host
• Database Username - Either one you created or supplied by your host
• Database Password - Either one you created or supplied by your host
• Database Name - Either one you created or supplied by your host
• Table prefix - The generated one below or create your own

@dgt41 : Placeholders are wrong, because they are not read by screen readers.

Can we mention "Either one you created or supplied by your host" only once? Is it even necessary?

It should be said once to guide users, definitely doesn't need to be repetitive though. A short sentence at the top of the block should be enough.

Is it even necessary?

Well, turn on voice over, switch off your monitor and reload the page and tab through...

Tests with users would be needed here. This is a problem of usability rather than a11y. However, such a solution seems to provide a complete instruction for the visually impaired and as well as the visionaries. This is in accordance with the principle: "Don't make me think" (Steve Krug).

this is one of the few point where you should think imho

So what other possibility is there for a Database if not one I created or someone gave to me.

https://codex.wordpress.org/images/thumb/5/5a/install-step3.png/600px-install-step3.png

Short sentence at the top of the box explaining we save stuff in a database and this info is either something you set up or were given or to ask your host/support how to get it. Then you have simple labels without the need to repeat help text on every line.

@mbabker except if you look at the text on the right for database host ;)

Didn't say that was perfect but it mostly illustrates what I would do without me having to invest time in clipping everything up to build a mock ?

Hmmm. There are 73 words in the Wordpress form. However, in the proposal for Joomla there are 66 words... And this text can be shortened to 48 more words.

• Hostname - "localhost" or a name provided by your host
• Database type - select from the list
• Database Username - own or set by your host
• Database Password - own or set by your host
• Database Name - own or set by your host
• Table prefix - own or generated by installer

But my English is weak.

@zwiastunsw - It's not about the overall word count, but about the word count in the label itself. I couldn't care less if we add a full paragraph of help text below each input as an explanation, but it's simply the current labels that are too long.

And I'm saying we don't need a help text for every field. An introductory sentence, similar to the one WordPress uses, removes the mostly redundant "one you set up or were given" comment we have now on most every field. Really we shouldn't need one for more than the hostname and table prefix with that. Unless there is some major UX or a11y thing I'm missing that makes it more efficient to repeat that type of comment 5 or 6 times.

@mbabker i agree with you - i was teasing about wp
It is more than good enough to have a heading text telling you where to get the information (either host or create it) and then just have labels

regarding word count. thats completely irrelevant. less words does not always mean it is easier to understand and it is also irrelevant for other languages. German users could probably use justasinglewordfortheentireinstallation

I agree that the number of words is irrelevant.
We have two issues here:

• labels
• tints

Someone previously proposed to combine these elements into one. That is not a bad idea. But the consequence is longer texts (label + tips).
We can decide on one hint at the beginning of the form. That is also a good idea.
Which solution is better? I do not know!
Usability tests with beginning users may be the answer. This is a task for the UX team (@jonrz).
Our opinions should not be decisive because we know exactly what this is all about.

I just wonder again, why is that information even needed "own or set by your host" - could people try to type in the database from the pentagon or what do we prevent with this hint? Maybe I am missing something...

Some hostings provide only one database, others need to create the database themselves.

And we are still missing an "Advanced Users" button to be able to keep the same Database name and also the same table prefix when doing a new installation (and adding bak_ or not).
In fact it would not only concern "Advanced Users" as @zwiastunsw correctly remarks above as a user may have to use a unique database. Imagine the number of tables with different prefixes in that case if he/she wants to reinstall a site from scratch multiple times...

Ok I've changed the language strings around, added some helpers and tweaked the headers:

Can remove some of the form helpers if need be

@brianteeman @mbabker @coolcat-creations

@C-Lodder if @zwiastunsw is happy (after checking with screen reader) with your changes I'm also otherwise let's leave this as is for the time.

Please change "Joomla name" to "site name"

And specify the database to connect Joomla to can simple be
Enter the database details

@brianteeman done

Specify the Host Name - lowercase Host Name

Host Name * and Database Name * - lowercase Name?

Why say Either and you created? We don't do it with Table prefix.

How about?
Specify a username or a username provided by your host.

I just wonder again, why is that information even needed "own or set by your host" - could people try to type in the database from the pentagon or what do we prevent with this hint? Maybe I am missing something...

@coolcat-creations It's to help guide users. They may not even be aware they have to set up a database to run Joomla, or that these credentials are not the same as creating your user account. For people who are running the installer consistently it's not text you really need, but think about this now in a new user perspective or a not-so-technical person's perspective.

Unfortunately. For the user of the screen reader all the tips below the fields are useless.
In order to use them, the user of the screen reader would need to constantly switch between browse mode (reading mode) and focus mode (the mode of interaction with the form). The accessibility of the form has been significantly reduced.

Not true. With the correct markup it is not a problem eg aria-described-by
See https://developer.paciellogroup.com/blog/2014/12/using-aria-describedby-to-provide-helpful-form-hints/ if you don't know how

@brianteeman: Agrees. This could be done in this way.

Which makes your comment pure FUD

@brianteeman yes using for and an id for the span should be ok, but:

• that code is not here
• that code is requiring screen readers to comply to the ARIA-DESCRIBEDBY which might not always be the case. The reason to have descriptive labels in the first place was exactly that, not using aria attributes wherever possible.

Anyways this PR as is is breaking badly accessibility!

aria-describedby is well supported
https://www.powermapper.com/tests/screen-readers/labelling/input-text-aria-describedby/