If joomla users want to stay with old ordering then
what about use a transaction start before loop and commit after it.
This also speed up queries.
Joomla use innoDB, postresql and sqlazure which support database transactions.

Your patch will do the same but it is more complicated.

What is complicated about it ?

it is actually very simple collect all updates in 1 query

also a transaction with multiple queries should always be slower or a lot slower,
or do you mean transaction with 1 query ?

SORRY AGAIN! This test is NOT RELEVANT! Forgot to select "successful".

I have tested this item ? unsuccessfully on c43254e

I have tested this item ✅ successfully on c43254e

I would prefer this solution against #11139 because ordering numbers are more transparent. Starting at 1 or so instead of 2147483647.

(But the more I think about this whole reordering issue I don't understand why we have to reorder the table while saving a new article. Ordering is an unsigned field. Why not just calculating min_ordering once and set ordering of new article(s) to (--min_ordering). If not possible because of field size, only then do a reorder starting at 1.)

Anyone testing

• PLEASE USE latest staging, making the ordering inputs visible in J3.5.?-J3.6.2 breaks the drag and drop as it breaks drag and drop ordering (does the JS selector need the input elements to be hidden ?)

FIX for visible selectors was merged in latest staging (for J3.6.3+) here: #11572

if you want to test drag and drop ordering, please be warned to remove the CSS change

I didn't and had no issues. Fields don't update without page reload. That's all

Off Topic:
Nice thing (just for my own private site) is that one can enter a number (e.g. -25). After drag&drop -25 is stored correctly in the database. You have to reload the page to see this ordering change in backend.

Please take a look at Review of solutions #11139 (comment)

I'm back to there because this is more related.
To be less race conditions you would only add one transaction.

BEGIN

-- loop on each 10000 queries: 
--    UPDATE max 10000 rows

COMMIT

this PR fixes performance issue and makes race issue very rare

but transactions are not be directly related to this PR

Joomla database API needs to add them first ?

• checking if current DB supports them
• checking if current sql user is privileged to do them
• adding some API calls for them

right ?

https://github.com/joomla/joomla-cms/blob/staging/libraries/joomla/database/driver.php#L2154

So it is safe to use regardless of enironment ?

i will make use of it,
thanks, small change in code of this PR

[EDIT]
i need to remove changes in articles model, and rebase it

I have tested transactionStart only on my own component.

You can see some example on fof library:
https://github.com/joomla/joomla-cms/blob/staging/libraries/fof/table/nested.php#L181

@alikon

I have managed to pull it locally and rebase it, (originally i made it from the GitHub GUI)
So it is good to test when you finished your other work (as you said)

• especially in non-Mysql DBs and see if some modification is needed for them

case/when/then/else/end expression, was added by SQL-92, so it should be supported by all DBs ?

added to my to-do list ?
not so sure if i will be able to test on MSSQL too

p.s.
seems travis is not happy

@alikon
Done, fixed the code styling,

Also updated the description of the first posting, to be up to date, shorter and clearer.
Any other testers welcome, especially if they can also test the non-mysql DBs too

I'd suggest checking your limits with the SQL Server docs. For an INSERT query, it only allows 1000 values at a time (see https://github.com/joomla/joomla-cms/blob/staging/administrator/components/com_finder/helpers/indexer/driver/sqlsrv.php#L543 for Smart Search where it hit this issue).

That code tries to do the same thing for the case of inserts

• i see 1 query per 1000 inserts

To be honest in this case i don't know of what limitation applies to the size of queries of SQL server

but, in our case the updates are really small strings

• e.g. for MySQL max_packet_size default value 1MByte , (some servers change it to much larger)

Let's say that the code below is 30 characters
WHEN 'NNNNN' THEN OOOOOO

you will get
1,000,000 / 30 = 33,000 updates (ok if you count some 10% overhead this maybe smaller)
to fit in the default MAX packet size of MySQL

in the code of this, i use 10,000 updates per query

i do not know if SQL server has smaller limits
(in size and in update record count, i need to check the docs ...)

we can probably change it to 1,000 with small or little performance drop

If the values were mostly variable length,
we can also count the characters (considering the multibyte of UTF8 too),
(that is what i do in my queries to avoid hitting the limit)

i will check the docs, but we also need a website, with some category with 30,000 articles for testing this properly

I can give you that or you can make your own using com_overload

Thanks brian, i have for MySql,

i have made a patch for com_overload to make it run faster, and had created a website with 500,000 articles

but i have not setup any Joomla web-sites in other DBs

I mainly just want to make sure UPDATE queries in SQL Server don't have the
same data limitations as INSERT queries, or others that are more
restrictive than the other engines. We've got a couple dozen users to keep
happy ya know ?

On Saturday, August 13, 2016, Georgios Papadakis notifications@github.com
wrote:

i will check the docs, but we also need some category with 30,000 articles
for testing this properly

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#11184 (comment),
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I hope this PR is proven good to be accepted for the other DBs too,
it will make many 3rd party extensions happy too )))

If you are on a mac then checkout http://postgresapp.com/ its super easy

On 13 August 2016 at 22:02, Georgios Papadakis notifications@github.com
wrote:

I hope this PR is proven good to be accepted for the other DBs too,
it will make many 3rd party extensions happy too )))

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Co-founder Joomla! and OpenSourceMatters Inc.
http://brian.teeman.net/

i have made a patch for com_overload to make it run faster,

@ggppdk
Can you give us the patch for com_overload to make it easier to test the PR #11184

for example create there https://github.com/nikosdion/com_overload/issues
a "New issue" and attach file/s

aahh, I need to remake it, i deleted several test installations, and localhost copies of sites,
to clean my local drives, it was gone with the cleanup

what's the state of this?

Good for testing

Humm didn't work for me i guess. please check animated gif

I retested just now, it works,

• saving new article
• reordering

what the animated gif does not seem to be relevant to this PR

• also you are displaying the select query in you animated gif, but i had suggested to display the UPDATE query, so that we can see the actual update taking place (after you click save and close)

Here how the update queries should be after after "save and close":

Ups sorry. Will retest latter

I have tested this item ✅ successfully on cdc5359

Tested and ordering seems fine.
Notice also a performance improvement: 400 articles in the same category

• Before patch: 82.4130 ms
• After patch: 16.5069 ms

  ---

  _{This comment was created with the J!Tracker Application at issues.joomla.org/joomla-cms/11184.}

i'm testing on postgresql with a category with 500 articles in one language

testing creating a new article

• before patch 1.818 seconds

• after patch 0.125 seconds

but i'm quite concerned about how long is the text of the SQL query (see animated gif) and how long it can became with more content,

suppose something like 100k content, i'm afraid we can exceed the limits of some common basic hosting server configuration in this way (especially cheap hosting with mysql basic configuration)

even if the #8576 has been reverted for B/C reason IMHO it is the most easy way to manage ordering
again for me is not correct by design to reorder all data when creating new items

From what I gather, this looks like a nice interim solution …
But I agree with @alikon (and the problem-inducing change in 3.6) that reordering on inserting is a bad idea. However, I have been bitten by the 3.6 change, too.
Couldn't this be a way forward:

• Offer an option to insert new items at the end in the DB (and make this the default in new installations).
• Offer a solution (button ?) to reorder existing items (for the category being displayed or for everything?).
• Then, there should be a "Reverse Article Order" option for the frontend. Probably with some post-installation message to inform/guide existing users.

This way, we could make the new behaviour the default for new installations; but existing installations wouldn't break (and get improved performance with #11184 ), and could make the switch at some point.
Sorry, I don't have any code to offer for this, but it seems like the "right thing"™ to me.

but i'm quite concerned about how long is the text of the SQL query (see animated gif) and how long it can became with more content

Actually there is no such problem,

• because is a limit to the number of records, current limit is 10000, see:

https://github.com/joomla/joomla-cms/pull/11184/files#diff-8254e2c441a41d3fa26f0f83fbbb3043R1374

which will make a query of 10,000 x 30 characters (WHEN ... THEN ...) thus less than< 300 KBytes, and this much lower than the MySQL default max_packet_size which is 1MByte (all hosts have default or more)

See comment
#11184 (comment)

so if you have more than 10,000 records you will get more than 1 UPDATE queries, e.g. 25,000 records you will get 3 UPDATE queries

so if we have 1.000.000 records we get 120 queries! to much queries! ?

@andrepereiradasilva If you have 1.000.000 featured articles then yes.
On each added featured article. But it is better than 1.000.000 queries now.

i was jooking ?

which will make a query of 10,000 x 30 characters (WHEN ... THEN ...) thus less than< 300 KBytes

plus for the IN()

10,000 x 10 characters [ IN (nnnnnnnn1, nnnnnnnn2, ......., nnnnnnnn) less than < 100 KBytes

so still under default max_packet_size 1MB ( should be the same on postgres )

call to @waader for a test on mssql

Reordering works with testing data installed but because of this #11932 i was not able to create new articles. So I could not follow the test instructions.

Also during the time i was making this PR i tested by using limit of 5 or 50 values to confirm that breaking the update Query into more than 1 update queries works:

https://github.com/joomla/joomla-cms/pull/11184/files#diff-8254e2c441a41d3fa26f0f83fbbb3043R1374

so you may want to test by adding a 5 or 50 limit to the above (depending on how many articles / records your category has)

thus the update queries, for updating 500 records will be 10 UPDATE queries

• also since the other "performance gain" PR to get last order number was reverted, and since no problems has been found for this PR, it would be good to get a milestone of J3.6.3 ?

The change of using last order number in new record creation was reverted
so J3.6.3, will now again have same slow down on new records saving in site with many records per category

This PR does not have a milestone

After upodating my joomla to 3.6.3 (from 3.6.2) I had problems with "504 gateaway" error when saving new articles.

Found this PR, did everything like its written and now its working fine.

Since PR: #11581 Revert "Performance gain - new featured article"
has fixed: #11103 New articles are created with last possible "ordering"

This PR was supposed to also be considered for accepting and merging, to address the performance issue,
(see my previous comment) but eventually this did not happen,

so J3.6.3 has the known JTable::reorder() performance issue (and in big sites timeouts can occur too)

[EDIT]
Updating multiple values in single SQL query is very important in terms of performance, when you need to update many values, and that this exactly why this feature exists in standard SQL !

Reading through this conversation and patch again, I'm still not 100% comfortable with this. It still seems as though it has been coded against default MySQL configurations. I've seen a couple tests for PostgreSQL, where frankly I'm not as concerned about it working since it usually behaves closer to MySQL anyway. I haven't seen anything in here at all for SQL Server (and yes it's still supported right now so that needs to be validated).

Two things I think need to happen:
1) SQL Server testing; this CANNOT be merged without testing on that platform as long as we make a claim to supporting it
2) How can this be improved to be better aware of environmental limits with the different platforms? This is hardcoded against MySQL's default configurations, what happens in the case where smaller limits are used or one of the platforms doesn't match the expectations added here?

I'm really not trying to be difficult, even if others think my arguments are BS. But we are making changes at the base level of the database integration layer and the changes need to be properly validated and flexible enough to deal with lower end configurations. So far, I think we're OK for default MySQL and PostgreSQL configurations.

There is a very old article that describe similar solution to this PR at http://www.databasejournal.com/features/mssql/article.php/1460001/Complex-Updates-Using-the-Case-Statement.htm

2) How can this be improved to be better aware of environmental limits with the different platforms? This is hardcoded against MySQL's default configurations, what happens in the case where smaller limits are used or one of the platforms doesn't match the expectations added here?

The query start breaking into multiple queries at 10,000 records, which is about 350KBytes
because 10,000 * 30 (or much less characters) + some overhead <= 350 KBytes

Max query string size for MySQL, default is: 1MByte
-- would anyone reconfinguring this to a lower limit and having a website with 10,000+ articles in the same category ?! (i have not seen such environments)

Max query string size for postgresql: 1 Gbyte

@mbabker

So, this is well below the default limits, but even if we change the limit to e.g. 5,000 or to 3,000 records per query the performance difference will be small / very small

• tell me and i will just can just change it now, no real performance impact to lower the default from 10,000 records to 3,000 records

The other idea could be use row_number described at http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3047789/how-to-enumerate-returned-rows-in-sql which is supported on mssql, and postresql from 8.4. For mysql there could be a workaround with @ variables. This is only idea.

@csthomas

You mean this PR (scroll to the bottom to see the query)
https://github.com/joomla/joomla-cms/pull/8563/files

I don't know what can be done, but all I know is this is coded against MySQL's defaults, and based on your comment I guess PostgreSQL has a bigger default. Are we sure SQL Server has a similar configuration? If so then it should be fine, but if not then this needs to be addressed.

Also, as I pointed out above, SQL Server has a stricter configuration with the number of records/values that can be set with queries. Maybe this isn't an issue with UPDATE queries as being issued here, but when I wrote the SQL Server adapter for Smart Search it was a very real issue with INSERT queries and the 10,000 records limit you have here exceeds the 1,000 record limitation I had to work around. So even if the configurations are OK for the query size (in terms of bytes), we may still have an issue with this aspect of it. Unless I scrolled past something, that was another thing I don't remember seeing an answer for.

Again, so far it seems like we're doing fine for MySQL and PostgreSQL for the most part. But there's still one environment with no testing that we claim to support. At least we're dropping it at 4.0 but we should still make sure it's working as long as 3.x is supported.

hhmm,

• i will test against postgress (@alikon had tested)
• about SQL server, i will try to install sql server lite (or something) and try to test with it too

Also even a very low limit of 500 records will have about 90%-95% of the performance benefit that 10,000 records limit per query gives

so we can just use 1,000 as limit of records and thus be sure of SQL server too

@ggppdk I thought about something more cross platform like #12839.

I ll find time to test

With the other PRs that have been merged addressing reordering performance, is this still valid?

This PR is no longer needed